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The Future
Topic Started: Apr 8 2010, 07:02 PM (1,439 Views)
skydancer0805
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The Fool of ADBZ
Okay, as the title suggests, this is a suggestion topic for the future(quite a bit forwards, actually).

As people have been seeing, many of us have been reaching our Tier 2 transformations. I had an idea of something to do for those who keep aiming for the next level.

First portion; new Tier of Super Forms. Now, these would be only a little bit stronger than our currents(like only +500 +5% stronger than SSJ and Form 5), but the requirements would be more extreme(like only obtainable at something like 275k or something). Awhile back, it was thought that maybe the next Tier would be based on Alignment and not race. Maybe this could be done?

Second portion; a change to how we view the Super Forms page. Instead of just seeing all there is on the page, the page could be changed to have three instead of one. The first page would be visible by everyone, but the second two would need passwords to access.
Also, the first page would only have the Tier 1 forms(Oozaru, Hidden Power, Forms 2/3, Awakening, Beast Form, Majin, Giji and Semi-Perfect).
The second page would have a password and the Tier 2 forms(SSJ, Forms 4/5, Spiritken/Super Spiritken, Transcendence, Perfect, Reaver and Fury).
The final page would also have a page and the Tier 3 forms.

Now, the suggestion for the password thing is to keep people wondering what is exactly behind those passwords. To get the passwords, you would need to meet certain requirements, which could be anything from only needed your previous tier trans or having that and meeting a certain PL requirement. There is another purpose as well.

Everyone can see that SSJ and Form 5 are pretty powerful. So, with the passwords in place, no one would be able to see that anymore, and thus they would hopefully pick more based on desire for awesome characters instead of awesome transformations. Be honest, how many people who come in and want to play a Saiyan are doing that 'cause of the SSJ form?

Now, this has little to do with changing or balancing forms, just making it so that newcomers are seeing only the tip of the iceberg of what they are going for. What would you say if suddenly you reach a certain power and "BAM," you find out the power of Fury or Death Reaver or SSJ?


I do see some negatives with this, though. If these pages are hidden, how will weaker members see what exactly the strength of their opponent's power is under their best trans? But maybe this could curtail them from challenging the stronger opponent? If you do not know your opponent's true power, it is better to wait until you can.

It is kinda like what happened to me when I battled Kyoto Kitsune oh so long ago. My opponent used his most powerful form, and to this date I still do not know exactly what the gainages of that transformation were. Thus, I do still contain a certain level of trepidation about Kyoto.


Now, this topic is put for suggestions about long-term solutions. My above suggestion would not be implemented for a few months probably, as the kinks would have to be worked out if accepted. So, any criticism or ideas are merited by me, as long as both are constructive. :)
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skydancer0805
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The Fool of ADBZ
Sorry for double-post, didn't want to cut from the flow of the previous post.

This is about sidekicks/henchmen. I want to place severe limits on the good guys Sidekicks so that the evil side keeps their large advantage in that field of helpers.

Now, these restrictions would be as follows: Cannot travel without leader and cannot battle without leader. Can search for dragonballs or unlimited rares. Cannot keep hold on dragonballs found. Can only use items with 'weighted' or 'weights' in the name.

And that would be it. This would reduce the capabilities of sidekicks so that good guys will still need to be banding up to take care of the evil characters who can get power faster.

Another thing to keep officers up to snuff would be allowing them the use of items with 'weight' in their name as well.

If this is already being implented, okey dokey. But if not, as above, give constructive opinions and criticism upon the idea. Nothing hinky. :)
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Ra
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I like the idea of hidden gains for super forms. I also like the idea of having max power levels hidden from the wiki's, but that cant really be done. But it would bring an interesting aspect to the game and prevent meta gaming.
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Kagetane Hiruko
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The Mad Hatter
I find it admireble to come up with such an idea, but as Ra said, keeping the trans-stats from the wiki's makes this game a bit dangerous. I put my trans stats on the wiki, just so people can see what they're up to. So they know that maybe a new strategy is needed.
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ravisi
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hiding gains from super forms won't work because when say, pan, battles someone she doesn't have to list the bonuses she gets, but you could probably tell that she is roughly 30-60 percent stronger when in SSJ... In addition, there are tons of ppl who would have access to say password 1 and pretty soon everyone would know what's hidden by that password. Yea i'm showing a pessimist point of view...

also anybody that knows what dbz is would prolly know that ssj is strongest. always
-
I do like your sidekick idea though, even though my character will probably always be evil.
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Seta
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The Right Turn in History
Quit using me as a god damn example! Rawr!

Anyways, I like the idea of hiding future forms. Mods should always have access to the information though, to prevent people from giving themselves wrong super form gains.
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Fonos
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And while we're on the subject of henchmen/sidekicks, is it possible to have a Lawful Henchmen? Or would that be a paradox of some sort?
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<OPTION>Fonos</OPTION><
<option>Demon/Alien</option>
<option>On Namek</option>
<option>PL: 28,774</option>
<option>Ban Count: 16</option></select>

Tarble 6:51 pm: That's the only thing I want to do now. I'll please you in ANY WAY

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ravisi
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1) why would it matter
2) i'm pretty sure all henchmen would be evil since you have to be evil to hire one (why would a good guy hire a bad guy)
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Fonos
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Well, I was planning on having my henchmen be lawful as it would help me slowly finish my first character arc, turning her neutral.
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<OPTION>Fonos</OPTION><
<option>Demon/Alien</option>
<option>On Namek</option>
<option>PL: 28,774</option>
<option>Ban Count: 16</option></select>

Tarble 6:51 pm: That's the only thing I want to do now. I'll please you in ANY WAY

Frieza: You're the worst damn pitcher I've ever had the displeasure of sharing a cramped white-van with

New Account - Tyrome[/align]
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Seta
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The Right Turn in History
Have you never heard of having an underling who wants to turn you from evil?
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Codyislost1
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I could see a henchmen having it's own personailty and if somethjing happening to them to make them kinda want something better for their master. You for example, Pan, your 'henchman' was your lover, so to say. If someone had gotten close to their henchie, and they do have personalities, then why wouldn't they? It would be some nice conflicting interaction in someones story.
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ravisi
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actually no pan, and i think logically that they would all be bad because if they aren't evil then there's no reason for good players not to hire them.
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Seta
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The Right Turn in History
Your argument is weak. Most people use henchmen just for battles or gathering DBs, they don't give them a personality. But as Ryu said, who is to say someone would not RP that henchman, letting it evolve and have a real personality?

Also, considering good people will soon have sidekicks which will be like henchmen, there is no reason a person who is evil does not get a henchmen and that hench turns into a sidekick thanks to RP sessions and such.

oh and the henchmen could just be mercenaries who don't care about good or evil, simply a paycheck. It's simple.
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ravisi
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I'm all down with creativity with their personality, as long as they're always on the negative alignment spectrum...

If a henchmen can be good then there's no reason that a good character wouldn't be able to hire one~

If I'm wrong, i guess i'm switching alignments xD
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NoJeice
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Tapion,Apr 8 2010
06:26 PM
Sorry for double-post, didn't want to cut from the flow of the previous post.

This is about sidekicks/henchmen. I want to place severe limits on the good guys Sidekicks so that the evil side keeps their large advantage in that field of helpers.

Now, these restrictions would be as follows: Cannot travel without leader and cannot battle without leader. Can search for dragonballs or unlimited rares. Cannot keep hold on dragonballs found. Can only use items with 'weighted' or 'weights' in the name.

And that would be it. This would reduce the capabilities of sidekicks so that good guys will still need to be banding up to take care of the evil characters who can get power faster.

Another thing to keep officers up to snuff would be allowing them the use of items with 'weight' in their name as well.

If this is already being implented, okey dokey. But if not, as above, give constructive opinions and criticism upon the idea. Nothing hinky. :)

Tapion, I'm almost absolutly sure you can only get one Sidekick, which will be between an officer and henchman. Evil people can get up to three henchmen if your a changeling, two if your anybody else. They're not supposed to be powerhouses when I suggested them, simply a way to help someone who needs help. Good people are usually weaker then the evil guy, with some lesser characters helping here and there to weaken the opponent so the good guy has a fighting chance when nobody else is around to help.

Also, I love the hidden transformations idea. Seeing less saiyans joining would really be nice, maybe have the alignment thing hidden too. I know many people probably go evil for TOM, its so insanely epic its only worse then the HBTC untill you reach 10,001 PL, which is just over the minimum to use it anyway.
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Ra
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Henchmen have the same alignment as their master. It was said by alex a while back, and I dont care to look it up again because there are like 30 pages of questions on henchmen.
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thechosenone816
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Granted, you can RP them as whatever alignment you want.

(Still wants to make a Chaotic Evil character who saves kittens on a daily basis just to exploit the system and get it changed...)

Also, as soon as someone knew the password for one of the transformations I can pretty much guarantee that everyone would know it.

...Hell, I'd start a damn spreadsheet and just watch other people battle to figure it out. Even a general range would pretty much null the entire benefit to hiding transformation gains.
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Quote:
 
10 Apr 12, 02:15 PM Taps: Kama, stop having fantasies about me and Trunks. They are creeping me out. >.>
10 Apr 12, 02:15 PM Kamatayan: It never actually happened, but it happens every night in my mind lol

23 Apr 12, 03:27 PM
Taps: Gawds, Sana thinking he so hawt.
Apr 12, 03:28 PM
Kenpachi: You know you want this ass

Vash 11:48 pm
    nah
    i just like the feeling of a boner
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ravisi
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I have -6 alignment and nobody cares that my character is 100% good in my rp's. When we refer to alignment we refer to bonuses and rules associated with it.

And while we're on the topic, I don't see why ppl say that evil is more powerful than good. What do evil ppl have? they have the tree of might seed which in reality, nobody will ever use. On the contrary, good alignment would be around 20k PL higher than evil seeing as though they can mozy into the hyperbolic time chamber.
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skydancer0805
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The Fool of ADBZ
That's just the problem, Sanara, you're thinking that it would be easy to figure out a trans gain. Let me tell you honestly, it is not in any way. Granted, maybe some program could help, but with what I did to figure out Kyoto's Angel of Death Form, it is truly a challenge.

Let me give you an idea of how difficult this truly is.

Base Stats
Power Level: 80,000
Ki: 40,000
Strength: 10,500
Speed: 11,000
Toughness: 8,250
Stamina: 10,250
Vitality: 11,000

Now, let us assume that the person is level 30. Thus, he/she has three passives and an armor that is not increasing his toughness. His/her passives are Street Fighter and Graceful and Pure Power.

Transformed Stats w/ Bonuses
Power Level: 122,220
Ki: 61,110
Strength: 16,319
Speed: 17,338
Toughness: 12,858(+175)
Stamina: 14,513
Vitality: 17,420

The stats are as above with the transformation. Would you be so kind as to give me the transformation gainages? Remember, there is a constant and a percentage you must find.
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Ra
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Chibi Torankusu,Apr 9 2010
03:59 PM
I have -6 alignment and nobody cares that my character is 100% good in my rp's. When we refer to alignment we refer to bonuses and rules associated with it.

And while we're on the topic, I don't see why ppl say that evil is more powerful than good. What do evil ppl have? they have the tree of might seed which in reality, nobody will ever use. On the contrary, good alignment would be around 20k PL higher than evil seeing as though they can mozy into the hyperbolic time chamber.

http://z10.invisionfree.com/alexsdbzrpg5/i...showtopic=28003

http://z10.invisionfree.com/alexsdbzrpg5/i...showtopic=27938

Frieza and Cold have both used it too. And old 13.

Most of the top 5 are are evil.
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skydancer0805
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The Fool of ADBZ
To support Ra's point, I have seen three uses of the ToM and I know of four people planning to use the ToM without chance of being stopped by any good guys.

Granted, the ToM requires the user to be powerful enough to defend their item and also slip it by the eyes of the more vigilant people.

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thechosenone816
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Sarge of ADBZ
I'm getting a +500 to all, +35% trans boost, accounting for Pure Power. Vitality and Toughness were a bit more off than I would normally accept but I attributed this to armor.

EDIT: More likely to be +500 as that decreases the distance between expected and actual Strength and Speed I calculated.
WALL OF SHAME
Quote:
 
10 Apr 12, 02:15 PM Taps: Kama, stop having fantasies about me and Trunks. They are creeping me out. >.>
10 Apr 12, 02:15 PM Kamatayan: It never actually happened, but it happens every night in my mind lol

23 Apr 12, 03:27 PM
Taps: Gawds, Sana thinking he so hawt.
Apr 12, 03:28 PM
Kenpachi: You know you want this ass

Vash 11:48 pm
    nah
    i just like the feeling of a boner
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skydancer0805
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The Fool of ADBZ
Sanara, your projected trans form gains are wrong. In truth, it goes as follows: +1000 All Stats, +25% Str, Spd, Sta, +30% Vit, +35% Tou.

And for this I used some basic stats. Imagine the difficulty in finding the bonus for our stats which are so much more random?
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Old133
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Bionic Warrior
I guess Sanara is just trying to say that if newbie's randomly look at battles- they'd be able to give a rough estimate on which super form is stronger or something like that?
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<SELECT style="background-color: #000000; color: #FF0000; font-family: Chiller; font-size: 18px; width: 200px; "><br /><OPTION>Android 13</OPTION><br /><OPTION>Race: Android</OPTION><br /><OPTION>Location: Earth</OPTION><br /><OPTION>Max Power Level: 21,000</OPTION><br /></SELECT></div>
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thechosenone816
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Sarge of ADBZ
Well, that and that people could just ask others for the PWs
WALL OF SHAME
Quote:
 
10 Apr 12, 02:15 PM Taps: Kama, stop having fantasies about me and Trunks. They are creeping me out. >.>
10 Apr 12, 02:15 PM Kamatayan: It never actually happened, but it happens every night in my mind lol

23 Apr 12, 03:27 PM
Taps: Gawds, Sana thinking he so hawt.
Apr 12, 03:28 PM
Kenpachi: You know you want this ass

Vash 11:48 pm
    nah
    i just like the feeling of a boner
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