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Are Saiyans Overpowered?
Topic Started: May 11 2010, 04:56 PM (899 Views)
Koyu
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I've been reviewing the main site throughout the past few days and it's come to my attention that Saiyans seem to be somewhat stronger than all of the other races.

First off, the only real drawback to being a Saiyan is that their tail can be grabbed during battle. But that only lasts until they reach a power level of 6000. I wouldn't have much of a problem with this, but there's also the fact that they can equip their tail as an accessory to prevent it from being grabbed. Though Saiyans do usually wrap their tails around their waists, this doesn't actually prevent them from being grabbed anime wise, as Goku was able to grab Raditz's tail while it was still wrapped around their belt.

The next thing is the Ozaru transformation. They're the only race that starts out with a transformation they don't have to do a quest for. Though the fact that their speed decreases with the transformation, their overall stats increase a whole lot more than any other first transformation. It's almost as effective as their Super Saiyan form. If it were only limited to happening at a full moon, I wouldn't be so concerned about it, but there's also the power ball technique, which, at the moment, has no limitations and can't be destroyed or burned out. The only real downsides are the loss in speed and the fact they can't use any techniques other than their mouth blast. I still feel that the form is overpowered, though. If there were some sort of other limitations, such as being able to destroy power balls or cut off Saiyans tails with certain attacks, I feel it would make this transformation a little more fair.

There's also the Super Saiyan form. Though this is very difficult to actually achieve, it boosts stats far more than any other transformation other than the 4th form for Changelings. Though it drains more ki, I feel it could somewhat tip the balance of battles that take place entirely while transformed. It's not the biggest issue, but I feel that other races should at least gain somewhat more stats upon transforming to make them more on par with Saiyans.

One of the biggest things I've noticed is that they gain stats faster than any other race. They even start with an extra 5% added to their stats. (Despite the fact your average Namekian or Changeling would probably be stronger anyway) They also get extra stats every time they loose battles as well as well as more gains from sparring. Someone who joins as, say, a human on the same day as a Saiyan would likely become outclassed by them relatively quickly.

While none of this is truly tipping the balance of gameplay, it does make it more difficult for those of us who aren't huge fans of Saiyans. (Or just outright generally hate their guts as in my case) Does anyone else think that Saiyans have some unfair advantages over other races? Does anyone think that there should be something done about this.

Pardon my criticism of this site, and if this came off as ranting, I'm truly sorry.

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Ra
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This discussion has been presented many times before.
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Fonos
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Beentheredonethat. I could probably dig up three topics in under five minutes with the same theme. But this isn't to begrudge you or anything; they are good points to bring up. It just doesn't seem like it will change. In Alex's words, "Saiyans are supposed to be the strongest."
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Alex
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In my eyes each race has quite a few advantages. Personally, being able to equip 3 accessories seems like the best perk.
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Alaric
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I would give quite a bit to be either a Changeling or have three accessory slots. But since Raditz is and always will be a Saiyan, and I like RPing as a monkey, I stay that way.

See, Saiyans are a little bit overpowered, but not TERRIBLY much. Not to mention, Saiyans were always considered to be the strongest, if I remember correctly. Not to mention that anyone could overpower a Saiyan by RPing more and better than them. It all comes down to the RPing, in the end.
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Dabura
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*Yawn* We all know what you're saying, but neither Pan or Alex want this to happen, so it won't.
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Kagetane Hiruko
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Yep, it's a topic many have fallen over. But just to say, except for the battle gains, the saiyans and Changelings are now perfectly on par in my opinion, because T4 doesn't take a turn anymore.

the two races that are in a serious disadvantage are the humans and the aliens.(except for the starting abilities and 3 slots, which still is nothing compared to the toprank transes of ssj and T4)
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Diive
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It seems fairly balanced to me. I don't think you're fully appreciating how big of a disadvantage having your speed cut in half would be in battle. The Ouzaru form has its weakness, and to me it seems like a pretty big one. But just so you know, once the form has been trained to Controlled Ouzaru then the character is no longer limited to Mouth Blast.

I also think that people should be able to destroy the Moonshine Blast, but only if they themselves know the Moonshine Blast technique.

However, I would be very VERY unhappy if someone could remove my tail without my control. That is a HUGE character decision, and it should be my choice if my tail comes off or doesn't.
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Seta
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As Alex has said many times before, you're supposed to be afraid of a Super Saiyan. Saiyans are supposed to be awesome.

And... as -I- have said, if you pick a race based on advantages you're doing your RPing skill a disservice. Must we go through with this again?

*flicks tail and struts off*
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Ra
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Pan,May 11 2010
04:26 PM
As Alex has said many times before, you're supposed to be afraid of a Super Saiyan. Saiyans are supposed to be awesome.

And... as -I- have said, if you pick a race based on advantages you're doing your RPing skill a disservice. Must we go through with this again?

*flicks tail and struts off*

You dont have a tail anymore.

And Ouzaru, controlled or uncontrolled, can only use physical attacks and mouth blast.
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Diive
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And Ouzaru, controlled or uncontrolled, can only use physical attacks and mouth blast.


Looks like I misinterpreted the description. My bad!
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Seta
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Ra,May 11 2010
05:30 PM
Pan,May 11 2010
04:26 PM
As Alex has said many times before, you're supposed to be afraid of a Super Saiyan. Saiyans are supposed to be awesome.

And... as -I- have said, if you pick a race based on advantages you're doing your RPing skill a disservice. Must we go through with this again?

*flicks tail and struts off*

You dont have a tail anymore.

And Ouzaru, controlled or uncontrolled, can only use physical attacks and mouth blast.

Yes I do Mr. I Don't Read Peoples' RPs. You can thank Dysta for it. So nyah to you.

And besides, it was meant to be cute.

Oozaru also cannot use anything besides physicals and mouth blasts. We have debated letting them fly (since Vegeta could) but... *shrugs*
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Alaric
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Diive,May 11 2010
04:25 PM
However, I would be very VERY unhappy if someone could remove my tail without my control. That is a HUGE character decision, and it should be my choice if my tail comes off or doesn't.

If someone cut off Raditz's tail without my permission, I would be extremely pissed. ALTHOUGH, I believe it should be able to be done under one of two circumstances - one, the owner of the tail gives permission, or two, there is an easy way to grow it back.
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Seta
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At the moment it cannot be removed without permission, that would be godmodding. EXCEPT in an official saga would I see it being okay so long as you could grow it back.
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Koyu
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I'm sorry if I annoyed people with my idea of cutting of Saiyans tails. ^^; If that could happen, I think a more than fair way to have it happen would be for it to grow back after going in a healing pod, eating a senzu, recovering from battle damage, etc.

And I'm sorry to have not looked through the forum to see how many times this has been brought up before. I'm such a n00b.. -_-
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Dante Amano
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Guys this stuff is always comes up every once in a while, every race has its individual benefits and flaws, what would you prefer that every race would be the same? Naw that would just be gay, this helps produce creativity so that everyone takes advantage of their perks in their own way. 'Sides I doubt you would be whining about this stuff if you were a saiyan.
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Diive
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Oozaru also cannot use anything besides physicals and mouth blasts. We have debated letting them fly (since Vegeta could) but... *shrugs*


Yeah, sorry, read it wrong ... but Flying Monkeys make me lol *grin*
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Alaric
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We are (technically) discussing how powerful a group of monkeys should be, and whether or not these monkeys, when they have been super-sized, should be able to fly.
I feel so weird right now.
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Dante Amano,May 11 2010
05:45 PM
Guys this stuff is always comes up every once in a while, every race has its individual benefits and flaws, what would you prefer that every race would be the same? Naw that would just be gay, this helps produce creativity so that everyone takes advantage of their perks in their own way. 'Sides I doubt you would be whining about this stuff if you were a saiyan.

No one ever really whines about their own race, just the race that is better than theirs.

Oh, you can thank Ra and me for the Oozaru only doing physicals and mouth blast. How's that for a shock?
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Dabura
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Don't go getting pissed or mad for no reason, Pan-chan. Actually, who really cares if an Oozaru Saiyan can fly? There are a gazillion ways to get passed that with the same effect, and without the Ki Cost. Even though huge, with such massive muscles an Oozaru may be able to jump pretty high, and they are already tall enough to hit those flying at what can be considered and "average" altitude.

I could get by without ever having Bukujutsu (I truly only have it because of Power Fly) by simply finding ways to get my character in the air. Maybe there is someone nearby with a cannon from a circus. I could have him get fired from it. He could climb a ladder, or jump really high. Afterall, I recall Goku climbing Korin's tower long before he could fly, and without using the Nimbus.

But truly, it isn't too big of a deal anyways, considering how often (Or the lack thereof) that Oozaru is used. The decrease in Speed makes it almost obsolete unless your opponent just is slow as molasses in sub-zero temperatures. Giji is far better than the giant monkey form, because the fact Speed INCREASES (rather than not) out-weights the noticeable difference in Powerlevel gainages.
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Seta
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I think we need to put a ban on this bi-weekly 'Saiyans are too good' stuff. It gets old.
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Dante Amano
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Pan,May 11 2010
06:25 PM
No one ever really whines about their own race, just the race that is better than theirs.

Oh, you can thank Ra and me for the Oozaru only doing physicals and mouth blast. How's that for a shock?

Oozaru sucks anyways, the speed loss is way too great and the only that you could compensate it a bit was with skills that improved speed but now that its only mouth blast and physical attacks its pretty much useless.

And no it isn't a shocker you have giji and normal SSJ what use would Oozaru do?
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Kagetane Hiruko
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I think it has to stay as it is, I mean come on, do we really have to fear the ssj? A changeling at 155000 with trans 4 vs a saiyan with ssj at 155000 will clearly, based on purely numbers and stats eventually fall before the changeling. So, the disadvantage of the last changeling form is gone and has made the changelings almost equal to the saiyans. I understand why saiyans should be a bit better in battlegains and all (hey can't change the series) and why changelings are build as the ultimate counterpart (again series).
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Gosai
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Eh, I'm pretty happy with the situation as it is. Saiyans just happen to have better advantages right from the start, but the advantages of other species are more 'long run' types of things.

And really only a few species have any particularly damaging disadvantages. I mean, for a Namek you just have to start on that planet.
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Diive
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Another thing to consider ... the humans are generally considered the weakest race, but the strongest character in the game right now is human.

The power you gain all comes down to how you RP your character.
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